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language tandem
For @cantatrice1 over in tumblr
Just a detail of language learning tandems, my experience with the apps I’ve used under the cut, and some advice for those starting out in that world. This post is long.
Using language tandems are a good way to practice your language skills, especially when it comes to listening and speaking. If your first language is English, you’ll have a LOT of people vying for your speaking time, which is a pro and con in itself, and I’ll touch on that later.
The great thing is that you can actually hear how the language should sound from a native speaker (generally, but I’ll get to that in a minute). Here are some good apps and general points to note from my experience doing this.
Apps I’ve used (and would recommend) are: hello talk, italki and Lang 8 (I’m on android. I think IOS has some other apps that are supposed to be as good or better, but I don’t know them). These are the apps that worked for me, but YMMV.
Hello talk is a good app. You can write sentences in the target language, correct sentences in the app. You can speak to people too, but if you’re getting to point of speaking and face to face, I do suggest Skype. But that comes after you’ve probably vibed with the people on Hello talk. The German guy I speak with, we met on Hello talk and pretty much carried on a conversation there (and correcting each other’s written sentences with increasing exasperation) for months. After a frentic back and forth of me correcting his pronunciation with ‘th’ and him doing me the favour with well... all consonants, I think we agreed to meet on Skype, and we’ve been bitching at each other every week since.
Italki is an app/meeting place that was generally designed for you to meet with teachers, I think. Students messaging each other just became a natural offshoot. I met three Spanish tandems via this app. Due to me being a native English speaker, I got a lot of Spanish interest. You can buy lessons (credits) on the app from $20 - $500 US and use it to purchase one on one with a native teacher. I have paid for lessons to focus on the parts of the languages that I have issues with. With Spanish, I’ve paid for lessons in terms of target writing (like job applications, or imaginary government enquiries). With German, a general overview of the alphabet, pronunciation re: umlauts, and a general overview of cases and declension.
Lang 8- a lot of the app is talking, and you can write in your target language and get corrections. But I do prefer the first two. They are easy to use, have a great interface, etc.
Language Level: Some people say that you should start to speak a language with a tandem ASAP, but don’t do that. I’d suggest that you get to a workable language level first. As in, know your conjugations for three main verbs in present, past and future tense (if you can. But at least know the present conjugation of three main verbs by heart).
When I started speaking Spanish with people, I knew how to conjugate ser, estar, tener and ir in those three tenses. A language tandem isn’t a teacher, because most people don’t know how their own language work. For instance, in English we don’t have gendered articles, a formal/informal you (which affects conjugation and approach re: friends and acquaintances), we don’t use reflexive pronouns much, and our subjunctive ‘were’ has been lost to the influence of North American laziness. Spanish... has all of that.
The more you know your target language and understand its structures going in, the more pertinent questions you can ask which will speed up your language learning.
Accent bias: I’d say that you should try and have an open mind with accents. I remember being rejected by a Spanish speaker because I didn’t have RP (the stereotypical posh English accent), and that’s what they wanted to jibe with. I told them to look for people specifically born and raised in the home counties, and wished them well on their search. Some Spanish accents are coveted (like the Medellín accent (Colombia: think James Rodriquez of Bayern Munich) because it’s so musical, and other people aren’t a fan of the sleepy Mexican accent. I pretty much take it as it comes. Just talk to me, and get me to speak. The Spaniard in Sevilla that I speak to, he has an Andalusian accent which is generally accepted as odd in Spain, and most people prefer listening to the Madrid accent.
For German, I mostly speak with people from East Germany who were already out of school when the wall came down, so their L2 was Russian, not English. Their accents aren't as lilting as say the ones who weren't under GDR rule. They tend to be direct in their desires re: learning English because strangely, they don’t feel German if they don’t speak English well (I... am still gobsmacked about that). So for a long time our German/English exchanges were pretty brusque, but with English being directly lead by social media, I told him that he had to consider urban dictionary a source, because trolls weren't beings who lived under bridges, but actual denizens of the internet. Their accents aren't as lilting as the people in the West, but eh, accents will accent.
Don’t get hung up on your accent if people don’t like it, but don’t be an arse about theirs either.
Treat it like a dating game: There are some people you won’t vibe with, and vice versa. That’s fine, don’t take it personally. You’re going to be spending (potentially) HOURS speaking with these people, so you have to like each other. I hear some guys can be skeevy, and if that’s the case, block and move on. I seem to attract the ones who are married, with children. They and their children speak English, but the wives don’t, or won’t. Well, in the beginning. With this Spaniard and German, their wives didn't speak English at first, but then they see their husbands speaking to women on Skype, and want to know why.
Then, because it's important to their husbands to learn the language, they go out of their way to try and say hi to me in English, and strangely, they learn the language as a result. I've been speaking with the Spaniard for a year, and the German guy... nine months? It helps that we like each other as people, and get each other's jokes. But there are people I've spoken with for twenty minutes and have never seen them again. Or people that I've started speaking with, but... we just petered out. You might speak with ten people before you're satisfied with one.
Have an aim After the initial chit-chat, going forward, your language hook ups should have a focus. Even though most people will just say, "All I really want to do is talk," still do some preparation. For instance, say you're speaking about holidays? You'd have that as a theme, and have vocabulary around that (and them doing the same for you). You might write and read a postcard aloud in the target language, and them doing so as well. The danger with English as an L1, is that that you're going to be lazy and speak English. I ask my tandems to be really strict with me speaking my target language with them, because I can teach the ins and outs of English all day to interested targets. So rock up with a plan, and a timer if needed. We mostly do half and half.
English as L1 Because your English is your L1, you'll have people just messaging you to speak. For instance, although I put in my profile Spanish and German only, I have people from Azerbaijan messaging me. Just... no. Not that I have anything against Azerbaijanis, it's just that my focus is on Spanish and German, and those are the people whom I wish to speak to, and no one else. My time is limited and precious. These are the languages I'm focusing on, and nothing else. I don't mind doing the odd language correction in italki (they have people who write a few paragraphs in their target language, and people are encouraged to correct the grammar, etc). I will do that, and answer a few questions on why things are so (because I used to teach English), but I shy away from correspondence.
That's enough to be going on with, I think. To sum up, have a basic working/knowledge of your target language (ideally A2 level), don't get hung up on your accent, treat it like a dating game with side pieces included, because there can't only be just one. For each chat go in with a focus, and pay strict attention to time, because as an English speaker, it's easy to fall into the trap of just speaking English. Guard your English as L1 status well, because you'll have a lot of attention for people to speak with you, but too little time (and interest, to be fair).
HTH.
Just a detail of language learning tandems, my experience with the apps I’ve used under the cut, and some advice for those starting out in that world. This post is long.
Using language tandems are a good way to practice your language skills, especially when it comes to listening and speaking. If your first language is English, you’ll have a LOT of people vying for your speaking time, which is a pro and con in itself, and I’ll touch on that later.
The great thing is that you can actually hear how the language should sound from a native speaker (generally, but I’ll get to that in a minute). Here are some good apps and general points to note from my experience doing this.
Apps I’ve used (and would recommend) are: hello talk, italki and Lang 8 (I’m on android. I think IOS has some other apps that are supposed to be as good or better, but I don’t know them). These are the apps that worked for me, but YMMV.
Hello talk is a good app. You can write sentences in the target language, correct sentences in the app. You can speak to people too, but if you’re getting to point of speaking and face to face, I do suggest Skype. But that comes after you’ve probably vibed with the people on Hello talk. The German guy I speak with, we met on Hello talk and pretty much carried on a conversation there (and correcting each other’s written sentences with increasing exasperation) for months. After a frentic back and forth of me correcting his pronunciation with ‘th’ and him doing me the favour with well... all consonants, I think we agreed to meet on Skype, and we’ve been bitching at each other every week since.
Italki is an app/meeting place that was generally designed for you to meet with teachers, I think. Students messaging each other just became a natural offshoot. I met three Spanish tandems via this app. Due to me being a native English speaker, I got a lot of Spanish interest. You can buy lessons (credits) on the app from $20 - $500 US and use it to purchase one on one with a native teacher. I have paid for lessons to focus on the parts of the languages that I have issues with. With Spanish, I’ve paid for lessons in terms of target writing (like job applications, or imaginary government enquiries). With German, a general overview of the alphabet, pronunciation re: umlauts, and a general overview of cases and declension.
Lang 8- a lot of the app is talking, and you can write in your target language and get corrections. But I do prefer the first two. They are easy to use, have a great interface, etc.
Language Level: Some people say that you should start to speak a language with a tandem ASAP, but don’t do that. I’d suggest that you get to a workable language level first. As in, know your conjugations for three main verbs in present, past and future tense (if you can. But at least know the present conjugation of three main verbs by heart).
When I started speaking Spanish with people, I knew how to conjugate ser, estar, tener and ir in those three tenses. A language tandem isn’t a teacher, because most people don’t know how their own language work. For instance, in English we don’t have gendered articles, a formal/informal you (which affects conjugation and approach re: friends and acquaintances), we don’t use reflexive pronouns much, and our subjunctive ‘were’ has been lost to the influence of North American laziness. Spanish... has all of that.
The more you know your target language and understand its structures going in, the more pertinent questions you can ask which will speed up your language learning.
Accent bias: I’d say that you should try and have an open mind with accents. I remember being rejected by a Spanish speaker because I didn’t have RP (the stereotypical posh English accent), and that’s what they wanted to jibe with. I told them to look for people specifically born and raised in the home counties, and wished them well on their search. Some Spanish accents are coveted (like the Medellín accent (Colombia: think James Rodriquez of Bayern Munich) because it’s so musical, and other people aren’t a fan of the sleepy Mexican accent. I pretty much take it as it comes. Just talk to me, and get me to speak. The Spaniard in Sevilla that I speak to, he has an Andalusian accent which is generally accepted as odd in Spain, and most people prefer listening to the Madrid accent.
For German, I mostly speak with people from East Germany who were already out of school when the wall came down, so their L2 was Russian, not English. Their accents aren't as lilting as say the ones who weren't under GDR rule. They tend to be direct in their desires re: learning English because strangely, they don’t feel German if they don’t speak English well (I... am still gobsmacked about that). So for a long time our German/English exchanges were pretty brusque, but with English being directly lead by social media, I told him that he had to consider urban dictionary a source, because trolls weren't beings who lived under bridges, but actual denizens of the internet. Their accents aren't as lilting as the people in the West, but eh, accents will accent.
Don’t get hung up on your accent if people don’t like it, but don’t be an arse about theirs either.
Treat it like a dating game: There are some people you won’t vibe with, and vice versa. That’s fine, don’t take it personally. You’re going to be spending (potentially) HOURS speaking with these people, so you have to like each other. I hear some guys can be skeevy, and if that’s the case, block and move on. I seem to attract the ones who are married, with children. They and their children speak English, but the wives don’t, or won’t. Well, in the beginning. With this Spaniard and German, their wives didn't speak English at first, but then they see their husbands speaking to women on Skype, and want to know why.
Then, because it's important to their husbands to learn the language, they go out of their way to try and say hi to me in English, and strangely, they learn the language as a result. I've been speaking with the Spaniard for a year, and the German guy... nine months? It helps that we like each other as people, and get each other's jokes. But there are people I've spoken with for twenty minutes and have never seen them again. Or people that I've started speaking with, but... we just petered out. You might speak with ten people before you're satisfied with one.
Have an aim After the initial chit-chat, going forward, your language hook ups should have a focus. Even though most people will just say, "All I really want to do is talk," still do some preparation. For instance, say you're speaking about holidays? You'd have that as a theme, and have vocabulary around that (and them doing the same for you). You might write and read a postcard aloud in the target language, and them doing so as well. The danger with English as an L1, is that that you're going to be lazy and speak English. I ask my tandems to be really strict with me speaking my target language with them, because I can teach the ins and outs of English all day to interested targets. So rock up with a plan, and a timer if needed. We mostly do half and half.
English as L1 Because your English is your L1, you'll have people just messaging you to speak. For instance, although I put in my profile Spanish and German only, I have people from Azerbaijan messaging me. Just... no. Not that I have anything against Azerbaijanis, it's just that my focus is on Spanish and German, and those are the people whom I wish to speak to, and no one else. My time is limited and precious. These are the languages I'm focusing on, and nothing else. I don't mind doing the odd language correction in italki (they have people who write a few paragraphs in their target language, and people are encouraged to correct the grammar, etc). I will do that, and answer a few questions on why things are so (because I used to teach English), but I shy away from correspondence.
That's enough to be going on with, I think. To sum up, have a basic working/knowledge of your target language (ideally A2 level), don't get hung up on your accent, treat it like a dating game with side pieces included, because there can't only be just one. For each chat go in with a focus, and pay strict attention to time, because as an English speaker, it's easy to fall into the trap of just speaking English. Guard your English as L1 status well, because you'll have a lot of attention for people to speak with you, but too little time (and interest, to be fair).
HTH.